Understanding Bessler

[James_Arne]

From Apologia Poetica - Should anyone wish to speculate about the truth,
let him ponder the rich pageant of words

From Maschinen Tractate - however, taking various illustrations together and combining them with a discerning mind, it will indeed be possible to look for a movement and, finally to find one in them.


This post is about the movement not found in his drawings but an understanding gained from having studied them.
The attached drawing is possibly similar to what he destroyed and would have been his reason for aplogising poetically about his machine.
In The Triumph Perpetual, it was a new wheel he built with a few modifications.
To understand some of his writings it is necessary to understand a little about chemistry and metallurgy. This is ebcause when he combined sulphur, salt and mercury, he had a metal alloy he could use to fashion bearings with. And without them as he rightly mentioned, his wheel would not have worked. If you have had silver fillings, it is not a solid but does need to harden as it is a mixture of mercury and powdered silver. He would have only needed to make molds.

With the "Children play among the pillars
with loud heavy clubs.
Acrobats and shadow-boxers", he is decribing the levers falling onto the hub which makes the knocking sound evedryone heard. They are like acrobats because as the weight falls inward, the fulcrum rotates above it which is similar to someone doing a sommersault or cart wheel, acrobatic moves. And the pillars are the spokes of his wheel.
And then there is " A wheel appears - is it really a wheel, for it does not have a normal rim.
It revolves, but without other wheels inside or outside, ".
The wheel's rim has a wide groove in it. And when the section that belongs there is once again pushed into it, it pumps water or what fluid he may have used.
And last but not least, there is "The things we eat run through every limb and sinue of our bodies" " He is refering to the blood which runs through our veains because it is pumped by the heart. he is comparing the mechanics of his wheel to the cardiovascular system of the human body.
Not sure, but am wondering how this was missed for so many years.Maybe people did not consider the truth of his words in the first 2 quotes I referenced. And I know I will be banned, right Alan ? But I did use my real name and not something like Lady Silver Belles, lmbo at that one.
Still, did Stefan ban you for your attacks against me when I only tried discussing Bessler ? When a working wheel is realized, he will be owed something for not listening to you and allowingme to pursue and understanding of Bessler's work.
Still, I may build this one day. Do need surgery so I can return to work. But as you always mentioned, it is Bessler's wheel and anybody can build it. This does require that person to do the work themselves and not expect someone to do the building while someone like you takes the credit for it. Be that as it may, it seems I have realized his wheel, even the understanding of whay a harder push makes it more difficult to stop. This is where understanding math really does help.
With momentum (Leibniz, who witnessed Bessler's wheel) said that momentum = mv^2. If you consider 1 kg * 1m/s ^2 = we'll say 9.8n. With 1kg * 2m/s^2 = we'll say 39.2n or 4 times the force. And with a weight that swings away from the axle, it can pump twice as much fluid. This is because the fluid has to move as quickly as the wheel rotates.
And if you use a leverage of 2:1, Then instead of pumping 1kg of fluids, the wheel could pump 4kg's of fluid because with leverage, it would have 8kg's of force.

Jim

p.s. The movement is observed in Mt 21. The weights on the levers (pendulums) generate a lot of torque at their fulcrums which is wasted potential, Bessler found a way to utilize it because he was smart. Mt 20 shows the basic mechanics as somewhat described in The Triumph.

By the way all, I know I'll get banned but I thought I would let Scott Ellis and John Collins have an idea about how Bessler's wheel really worked and what some of his writings meant. And as for it getting built, doubt that will happen until I can get around to it. After all, I have read the posts and they all focus on who gets credit for inventing Bessler's work but nothing about demonstrating Bessler's intelligence or accomplishments (wheels), sadf is all I can say.
I think when all is said and done, John would get credit for his contribution in making Bessler's work known.
Difficult to over look, but since Bessler's work is a part of German's History and could be considered property of Germany, no business would be allowed to reproduce Bessler's wheels wwithout germany's permission. As John mentioned, there are International Laws protecting historical artifacts associated with their countries.

edited to add; in a basic demonstration, the weights on the levers would land on the hub, and when they swing away, they would be close to the outer boards but not on them. This could be what confused someone when they said they saw the weights landing on short boards. It's possible they did but this would slightly reduce the pressure applied to the pump. It is possible it was done to give a rest to the levers to help prevent them from breaking.

[James_Arne]

This drawing shows how what I believe to be a basic bessler wheel could be constructed.
By placing a tube inside the outer rim, when it is compressed, it would pump water or other fluid. To seat the tube, it would be inlaid into the outer rim. This would help to seal it as well as maintain it's position in the wheel which would be quite important.
With a 40 inch diameter wheel, the radius would be 20 inches and the circumfrence about 120 inches.
This would allow each section to be about 15 inches. What would need to be remebered i9s that the moveable parts would need to be shorter so they can move inward without interfering with each other.
With a 40 inch radius, it is close to 1 meter. Also, if the voulume of water or fluid were approximately 1 inch deep by 4 inches wide by 15 inches, this is about 60 cubic inches or slightly more than 2 pounds or about 1 kg.
It is something that the dimensions could be understood by people who are familiar with the metric system or the SAE system. Comparable values.
A more advanced design is possible but for an intial attempt, simplicity should be considered an over riding factor.
As such, 1 kg @ .5M is 4.9nm or about 4 1/2 ft. lbs. of torque. And with 8 1 lb. or .5 kg. weights, it would have a nice weight to over balance ratio.
something not achievable with weights only. For anyone interested, a quarter section would sufficiently test this concept.

[Tarsier79]

Dear troll

Although you believe you have some personal gift and understanding of Besslers wheel, let me assure you that you do not. Although your infantile attempts at solving this problem are expected from a beginner, most beginners wouldn't be delusional enough to believe that they alone have a unique understanding of gravity that defies the laws of physics.

Whatever your personal grievances you believe you have with certain well respected members of this forum exist only in your head. You are your own worst enemy.

Seek help

Yours Sincerely

Kaine

[James_Arne]

Kaine,
forgive me for thinking so, but I would believe my schooling and experience in engineering has helped me to understand Bessler's work.
I really have no vendetta as you so eloquently put it. I did build some of his drawings which was helpful. Also, I have studied math.
I think what you are missing is that free energy is utilizing a potential source of energy previously ignored. in your post, you failed to reference anything in engineering that would suggest I am wrong.
The simple reality is that as a wheel rotates, a weight resting on the hub will swing away while another falls on it. Bessler's reference to children at play among the pillars, it is the childs toy in MT 138.
With 8 levers, there is no over or under balance, what you gain on one side, you lose on the other. But the potential (torque) of a swinging weight is not used to perform any work. Simply moving weights towards center and then away from it, it is very difficult to create a sustainable over/under balance.
this is where using the torque from a swinging weight to pump a fluid around the rim allows for an over balance that is 1/2 the force (torque) of the leveraged weight. The other half of the force is that the fluid being pumped would need to move quickly or otherwise the wheel might become bottom heavy.
But then free energy is just that. It can get a bit technical but will just stick with using torque to pump fluids with.
What is not lost on me is the first working wheel most likely would become a museum piece, after all, it would be the first proven perpetual wheel. But with me, I think for the work I have put into it, I would have to believe Bessler put in much more and to see his work realized is something I think many people outside of these forums would like to see, they just don't know it yet. It would give them something to marvel at and to think about.

Jim

[Dwylbtzle]

if yer just doing something that is just moving the water around
i wouldn't be able to see how that helps
but that means NOTHING it just means i can't see it

if something in there is tapping the energy yer getting from ANY buoyancy
effect then you might be on to something
because whatever energy or force or function yer getting as a result of buoyancy
is free energy that you managed to glean from the earth's gravity

see post here
http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... p?p=101420
any system that includes some function provided by buoyancy
well THAT function gets whatever energy it supplies (or needs)
from the earth's gravity
because buoyancy is the earth's gravity pushing down on something--which then causes that something to push UP on something else

if wood floats in water
it's because gravity is pushing the water down and that forces the water
to push the wood up

but nothing HAS to be water (or wood)
and nothing has to end up floating
the something is gonna get pushed down and then that something is gonna push UP on something

just because a lead weight doesn't float doesn't mean it doesn't weigh less in water
because it does
that difference in weight is the free energy (or potential energy, rather) that you just got from gravity!
and it cost yer system nothing except whatever the hell it took you to get
that piece of lead under the water
and that object (in this case: that piece of lead) retains that potential
forever
as long as yer in a gravity field
it doesn't run out
you don't have to replenish it
and you don't have to bring anything back around

(this wouldn't work in a freefall of course--
or in space
like in a spaceship
unless they had a deck that was on the outside of a spinning wheel
or had some kinda science fiction artificial gravity field in play
on board)

[Tarsier79]

http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... highlight=

It has been thought of before.

http://www.real-free-energy.co.uk/new%2 ... m#Page%203

And built.

If the multi-lever phenomenon were fact, any number of levers more than 1 would prove that, and you would have a working wheel. Skimming down the page I see: "I just have to make more levers and heavier weights"(paraphrasing). If you want to prove your theory works, you should put your dremel + attachments to work to start cutting out levers, then use your professed mathematics skills to understand why it doesn't.

How many times have you stated "engineering" as an arguement against logic and mathematics, only to harass people on multiple sites, claiming you know the answer and have no need of BW, or Overunity.com, only to pop back up under a different name.

Jim/James/John.... whatever you have called yourself in the past...
Q: What is the definition of madness?

A: Repeating your actions over and over, but expecting a different outcome.

[James_Arne]

Kaine,
Think I will wait until I can return to work and build it myself.
Its not an easy build, it requires a lot of patience.
Simple reason being that the fluid being pumped is the opposing force to the falling weight on the long lever and is the reason the wheel would rotate.

Jim

edited to add.
Kaine, I had bought tools for a shop I had, but I guess where I am willing to work at it is a good reason for people like you and Alan to dislike me.
But it is as Bessler said, the motion is in his drawings if you can understand them and I do. They are Besslers way of teaching someone if they are willing to learn.
Myself, I learned a lot from them.

Jim

[Tarsier79]

I don't know you, I dislike the way you have acted in the past, and the continuation of your attitude shown in your first post.

"Understanding Bessler"

I can guarantee you that your understanding lacks insight. Gravity is conservative, and by that I also include everything gravity driven, including Hydrostatic pressure. Your design will not work.

[James_Arne]

Kaine,
I can build this when I return to work.
As for my being disliked in other forums as you said, overunity is where I post and they like me there.

Jim

p.s., because of the effort it takes to understand this design and how to build it, I dont worry about similar designs that have not worked.
If I explain what they did wrong, then I would be proving their work.

Jim

edited to complete a sentence by adding the word said.

[James_Arne]

http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... highlight=

It has been thought of before.

http://www.real-free-energy.co.uk/new%2 ... m#Page%203

And built.

If the multi-lever phenomenon were fact, any number of levers more than 1 would prove that, and you would have a working wheel. Skimming down the page I see: "I just have to make more levers and heavier weights"(paraphrasing). If you want to prove your theory works, you should put your dremel + attachments to work to start cutting out levers, then use your professed mathematics skills to understand why it doesn't.

How many times have you stated "engineering" as an arguement against logic and mathematics, only to harass people on multiple sites, claiming you know the answer and have no need of BW, or Overunity.com, only to pop back up under a different name.

Jim/James/John.... whatever you have called yourself in the past...
Q: What is the definition of madness?

A: Repeating your actions over and over, but expecting a different outcome.

The links you posted have nothing in common with what I posted. I think that would be considered delusional or just plain jealous.
Since you have nothing, all you can do is ridicule someone else, nothing new there.
You know, it's like Alan told me once, if he doesn't get credit for what I do, then he'll do what he can to discredit me. And that is all he's been about when it comes to me and could be why Stefan banned him and not me.
By the way Kaine, you are right, I don't need the forums since I have figured it out. You sound almost like Christo, rout a circle and you have a wheel. if it were that simple, I would have been done with it a long time ago. But it does take learning a lot of technique to build a wheel like Bessler's, something you probably know nothing about probably because you don't build anything.
But you are good with the insults, but those don't help to understand how something works or what it takes to build. And it is a definite NO that somebody has built something like what I have posted. I think it's funny how much I hear that and when i look, I can only wonder what someone like you was thinking.
At least the folks at overunity dot com are interested when I can get back to work and start building again. It does help being able to work 40 hours a week.

Jim

edited to add; Dude, this is the quote from Mt 24, it belongs with Mt 60. Not sure, but that has been over looked for 300 years and is rather obvious.
"This invention ought not to be scorned. It consists of separate levers with weights. Between the weights are small iron poles with screw threads. The poles fall inward when the levers close. There is something one must learn first before one can grasp and correctly understand the good quality of the invention."
- Johann Bessler

edited to add; @All, this is what Kaine claims is the design I posted.
The 2md pic of course. it's not even close. With Bessler, 8 levers are all that is needed and not the 64 Travis uses. Also, with Bessler, each lever weight combo acts on one moveable curved board which acts as a pump in the rim. I don't see that with Travis' design.

[James_Arne]

@All,
It will most likely be a couple of months before I can start building this. Will need one last surgery (hopefully) and then will be able to set up a shop again.
The design is pretty basic when you become familiar with it. With how Bessler would have sealed a leather tube I think is genius. He would have had a board from each side squeezing the leather together. The boards holding it in place would have had wooden pegs going through them to the outer part of the wheel. When warm water is poured on the pegs, they would swell and become an old timey fastener.
With the wheel, by removing excess wood on it's outer part, he could have left ribbing which would have helped to keep the wheel round and prevent it from bulging out in the middle, think grid here.
And the basic math is 8m/a where 8m is the 8 weights and a is the acceleration potential of the overbalnce. Something to give a rough idea using Newtonian Classical Physics.
Or simply put, 2 lbs. of water should be able to rotate a wheel weighing 10 to 12 lbs. And this would require a leverage of about 4 to 1 using 1 lb. weights.
With the shop I had set up, I was able to try different things as to what might work best in building a wheel of this type. Of course, like anything else, a person's own experience might have them find a different way than what I have thought of to be easier.
I did see on woodsmithshop on PBS where they used a jig to clamp together boards that they had soaked in warm water to soften them. They pre bent them by clamping them in the jig and let them cure or dry out.
Then they used a polyurethane glue to glue the laminates together and then clamped them in the jig. It seems the prep work is the hardest part of making this type of wheel. But then, it is unique and as with any Bessler wheel, they will be custom builds.
Jim

edited to add; I found that rockler.com has thin plywood in 1/8" thickness.
It's what I will be using. One thing I found is that going with the grain direction from side to side, it has little flex, even at such a thickness. And going lateral to the grain direction it is more flexible. I will probably try alternating grain directions to achieve maximum strength both laterally and following the circumfrence of the wheel.

[James_Arne]

@All,
Almost forgot to mention, once you know how much overbzlance or water is needed to attain a certain rpm, after that, any extra over balance can be used to perform work like lifting a pallet.

Jim

[Andyb]

James looks possible if a innertube approach was used on the outside of the wheel, all you would need to do is squeeze ,i kind of like it but sometimes i am so dumb,
good luck with your health, i think i will think on this some more, thank you for sharing your work, all the best Andy.

[James_Arne]

Thanks Andy.
You did get the basic idea right. With the attached drawing, a 3/8" x 4"
board would work for the curved parts. The pieces that go inward and outward are supports. A plastic tube could be used for the inner tube.
With what I am doing, I am trying for a somewhat authentic build and I think Bessler might have used leather for his tubes.
The extra effort would be necessary to show that Bessler could have done just what he has claimed he did do.

Jim

edited to change drawing

[Silvertiger]

Just a wild thought, possibly in addition to trying to move four times a weight with one, but it occurred to me that two horses in line is twice a horse, but two horses side by side is four horses, probably the most ancient form of power distribution...that's all. It might be in addition as well to the principle of having two wheels sharing the same load. Just a thought, mind you, very fleeting.