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turulato
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 Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 2:10 pm Post subject: re: The joy of not knowing |
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Jonathan said;
| Quote: | | the evidence I've seen indicates that people are eager to believe that UFOs and crop circles are caused by aliens, or at least that aliens exist and may be visiting |
True statement, 60,000 people were so eager to believe, that a French race car driver said he talked to 4 foot alien that told him we were created by him and those poor people believed him, so he founded the Raelian movement. Not only that but an American named Joseph Smith said he found books written by Moroni as an extension of the bible and now is a 4 million member cult known as the Mormons. A Canadian guy named Charles T. Russell under the guise of biblical study created another cult known as the Yahova Witnesses. A Korean the Moonites, another American scientology, a German communism, another German Natzisim......and the list goes on and on.
Bottom line; we believe what we want to believe!
Truth becomes irrelevant for most of us or like Jonathan says; "because we don't know any better". Yeap, we are nothing but a bunch of sheople :-)
Live long and prosper.
Turulato
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rlortie
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Jonathan
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turulato
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ovyyus
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:14 pm Post subject: re: The joy of not knowing |
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| Quote: | | Bill, then how do you prove it? Simply experiencing A and B in sequence doesn't prove causation. You must interpret the experience with reason, and this requires axioms, logic, and overall, belief in something. |
I suppose you're right. Even my cat will pull it's paw out of the way if I try to drop a hammer on it - well, at least after the first time :) - proof that it possesses axioms, logic, reason and belief!
Jonathan, you obviously have the right not to respond, however... what do you think of the "intelligent design" debate? Also, what do you think about the many Christians who choose to adhere to Biblical chronology that suggests the Earth was created by their god less than 10000 years ago?
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racer270
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:29 pm Post subject: re: The joy of not knowing |
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Turulato; christians were a "cult" in jesus's day.........
and it is Jehovah witness, not jehova witness......read matthew 24.14
i study the bible with them every week, and they the ones that have it right, one man did not do it all, and there are more then 11 million Jehovah witness world wide.....your prospective is through rose colored glasses,your are right not to aggre with the bible interpations of christanity, but from what you posted i can tell you haven't been exposed to bible truth...........
ps i know my spelling is bad, but i know the truth of the bible and why jesus died for are sins.
gordy
edit: ovyyus, god's day is 1000 years long , he created it in 7000 years+..........
also "judjment day".........is also 1,000 years long. ie: a mere boy will die at 100 years old.
it is much deeper then "besslers wheel"
god has always been, we as humans cant even conceive " how long always is" ........ ? can you ?
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ovyyus
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ken_behrendt
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| Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:33 pm Post subject: re: The joy of not knowing |
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Interesting discussion on "why" people believe.
Jonathan wrote:
| Quote: | | Ken, the evidence I've seen indicates that people are eager to believe that UFOs and crop circles are caused by aliens, or at least that aliens exist and may be visiting. |
I agree than many people in any society will believe whatever "authority" figures tell them is reality. It's all part of the "herd mentality". The least critical thinkers in any group automatically turn to the "thinkers" for answers to the problems of life. They have, during the course of their lives, lost confidence in their own reasoning ability and leave it to others to take care of decision making for them. Those others often enjoy the feeling of power that they derive from having so many people dependent on them for guidance. In a sense the two classes of people justify each others existence and can then form a stable society.
When an independent thinker comes along, he will be tolerated by the thinkers of the society as long as he does not challenge their authority. If he does, then the thinkers will do everything they can to marginalize that independent thinker. This can range from ridicule to disfellowship to outright murder if need be.
I always urge people to try to get as many facts as they can and then draw their own conclusions from them. Societal leaders should always be held accountable for their actions or lack thereof and any decisions they make should be subject to scrutiny and questioning by the people that those decisions will affect.
As far as crop circles are concerned, I think about 99.99% of them are hoaxed. Someone noticed that the majority of them are always formed in fields on weekends. Apparently, the hoaxers have to get up early for work during the week and can not spend the night trespassing on some farmer's property to make the patterns. On the weekends, however, they have the time!
Of course, this does not mean that some of the impressions found in grain fields are not made by actually extraterrestrial craft. UFO's, in general, very rarely land on the Earth's surface. They prefer to remain hovering and airborne in the event that they have to take immediate evasive action in case some military jets show up!
While hovering over a grain field, the plasma downwash from a UFO's hull can cause long stem grain plants to swirl themselves into interesting spiral patterns. Additionally, infrared and ultraviolet radiation emissions from the plasma that surrounds a propulsively active UFO can dry the grain plants or even scorch them. In any event, the patterns formed by real UFO are never look like the precise geometric patterns made by the hoaxers. Real UFO patterns tend to be irregular swaths or patches depending upon whether the craft was traveling horizontally over the field or just settle down vertically into it.
Only very rarely does a UFO make contact with the Earth surface and, after regaining its normal mass and weight, can leave landing marks that are deeply pressed into the soil. There have been penetrameter measurements of some of these impressions that indicate the object that made them had a weight in the tens of tons!
ken
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On 7/6/06, I found, in any overbalanced gravity wheel with rotation rate, ω, axle to CG distance d, and CG dip angle φ, the average vertical velocity of its drive weights is downward and given by:
Vaver = -2(√2)πdωcosφ
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racer270
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SeaWasp
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Jonathan
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| Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 2:54 am Post subject: re: The joy of not knowing |
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Turulato, my guess is that you heard it from Techstuf then. Michael Savage is coarse radio show host, IINM he coined that term, though he obviously didn't come up with the idea.
Bill, I'm not sure yet. I have discussed theology with Gordon a lot; I usually don't agree with him though. If you take Genesis literally except for the day lengths and presume as few miracles as possible, then it doesn't seem to make sense, because plants would have to live a long time before the Sun was created. And even if the days are not listed in chronological order, then you'd have the problem that it'd be hard to interpret the text in a way other than 'God made things as they are' (as opposed to, 'God made a bacterium which changed and became other things'). I've beening meaning for sometime to resolve this, I figured that I'd have to get degrees in astrophysics, nuclear physics, geology and paleontology so I could analyse the data myself (I prefer to have myself to blame when I'm wrong, rather than getting bad info from others).
Seawasp, karma is from Hinduism, I'm sure they're on the wrong path.
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SeaWasp
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Jonathan
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ovyyus
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SeaWasp
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| Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 3:46 am Post subject: re: The joy of not knowing |
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Jonathon...
Hindus believe that there are many paths to God Yes.. As long as it's not Christianity or Islam etc.. I am aware with the theory behind the religion. But I watch the battles between the Hindu's and Muslims on TV all the time! (Kashmir) I am sure that personally, subjectively, the people don't practice what they preach!
Even though the Christian, Jew & the Muslim worship the same God, the path they each take, is different to Him! Just as your perception that the Hindus are on the wrong path! Who is right & who is wrong? well that depends on the person! That's why my point is that we will all know when we die!
Good things happen to bad people, and bad things to good people, all the time. ... Yes very true! Good people are tested all the time by pain & suffering for whatever reason! But they can if so desired, dig deep, persevere, and eventually find happiness again. (Good Karma?) It is the bad folks who will eventually, "die by their own sword" etc.
Bad things happen to bad people cause they caused the badness! It is a self inflicted position! and a position which draws consequences!
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