Forum Index
BesslerWheel.com
Discussion Board

Log inLog in RegisterRegister SearchSearch BlogsBlogs Blog NewsBlog News PollsPolls FAQFAQ FAQWiki
Forum Index
Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual motion machine.

 
Page 2 of 9 Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forum Index -> General Discussion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Aman
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Joined: 08 Mar 2012
Posts: 235
Total Words: 19,931


Reputation: Disregarded by many
Disregarded by many  
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

My advice is never ever try to make Perpectual machines!
Try to make real Non Perpectual gravity engine machines and as of now,there are mostly only three somehow easily thinkable Ways to do that:
1) weight shifting and proper force distribution
2) proper force distribution and impulsive energy utilisation!
3)Mix of 1) and 2) partially

~[There are few more ways which include manupulating Gravity on Quantum physics scale which may provide very high power output,but very very complex and difficult to understand!Working on Quantum scale does not gaurantee that that engine will work because there are many unproven (not proved)different Quantum theories contradictory to each other(For example :Quantum Gravity field theory)But working on 1st or 2nd or 3rd way discussed gaurantee the workability of engine because the theories used are proven and used daily]~

I had initially used unbalanced mass system (Weight shifting)in my old design and it was possible to make it using precompressed air weight shifting,using bellows,springs,etc!
But my new design without unbalancing can produce more output, and easy to maintain!
The phenomeneon of fatique,creep etc can be reduced by using new design!

Fatique,creep,etc are all mechanical engineering concepts.

If bessler wheel really works,then it would be Non-Perpectual.it may use either of 1),2) or 3)rd way/method.
Note that we here only convert static gravitational energy into dynamic usable energy!Nad we are not generating any new energy.

The purpose of my discussion is to let people know the reality,instead of speculations and doubts,so that we can make our planet greener!Hence this discussion is one of the most Important discussion on BesslerWheel.com till now.

Now,I am trying to future modify my design by using the same analogous principle to make my design more compact and more efficient!


Back to top
View user's profile Blog
Tarsier79
Addict
Addict

Joined: 12 Mar 2010
Posts: 2170
Total Words: 156,176
Location: Qld, Australia

Reputation: Well respected
Well respected  
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:56 am    Post subject: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual mot Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Aman, you claim to have a gravity engine that works, but supplies little power, and you wish to increase its efficiency and power. I used to believe gravity was a power source, but all my experiments, and the equations derived them say otherwise.

This would lead me to one of three conclusions.

1. You do not have a working gravity device. You are misleading this group, and will be soon banned.

2. You have a device, its energy source has not been put forward, or you are failing to tell us of the extra energy expenditure from a known power source.

3. There is a miscommunication, possibly due to a translation error.

My belief, and that of many others here (including the wider scientific community) is that gravity alone can not produce an overunity. You say you are not breaking any laws. Since you are familiar with scientific laws, does your device break Newtons second law? If not, it will not revolve with gravity as the prime mover.


Back to top
View user's profile Send email MSN Messenger
Aman






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Yes,there is a miscommuniction.because of these:
1)people trying to invent Perpectual machines without understanding physics and without thinking
2)people trying to cheat.
3)Some one told that gravity engines are Perpectual and hence can't work,which is false and many people accepted this blindly.
Just think,how much energy you can store in a ball with a bat!So much that the ball does no simply move,it actually travels further.Same is happening when heavy ball is acted over by gravity,which you can use as impulsive force!
I have deviced a mechanism by which you can recover the energy supplied to lift heavy piston PLUS use impulsive energy by proper force distribution.

It requires extra ordinary intelligence to invent such engines!Not every one can do this!

Due to patent processing laws,I am not able to leak out the exact mechanism ,but that doesnot prevent me to explain the analogous principle of my engine,as discussed in my first comment!
Really sorry for this!
Also I have tried to explain how you can do proper force distribution on Flickr on:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/59145126@N07/6829601232/in/photostream

Also regarding to your doubt about obeying newton's laws,please read my engine's principle as discussed in my first comment here and also see Flickr webpage I mentioned.Note that I am using the concept of impulse and proper weight force didtribution specal technique as discussed on flickr.I am only converting gravity into electrical energy.After seeing all those, ask me doubts if you have any.
But first of all,you should know what is "impulse" in physics.




Last edited by Aman on Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:44 am; edited 1 time in total. (17 percent)
Back to top
View user's profile Blog
raj
Devotee
Devotee

Joined: 09 Dec 2009
Posts: 1049
Total Words: 82,571
Location: Mauritius

Reputation: Respected
Respected  
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:38 am    Post subject: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual mot Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Aman!
Allow me to comment on your reference to patent processing laws.

In this day and age, anyone can apply for the grant of a patent online within minutes, without having to pay a penny. Try UK IPO.

Then minutes later you can display your invention to the whole world without fear. Because your Patent Rights will be safeguarded for a whole year from the minute of your application.

I should know because I have made several patent application and I am a holder of a Wave Energy Device Patent.

If you genuinely have an invention that works, that would be the way to go. Then you would be a happier man, discussing freely your invention on this forum.

Raj


Back to top
View user's profile
Aman






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Thanks!The problem in India is college has told me that they will be processing my patent


Back to top
View user's profile Blog
raj






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:50 pm    Post subject: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual mot Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Make sure who will be the Patent Rights owner. You or your College, as they can process the patent application as APPLICANTS and you, only as inventor.
It's applicants who are patent rights owners. Not inventors.

Good Luck with your patent processing.

Raj


Back to top
View user's profile
AB Hammer
Addict
Addict

Joined: 06 Oct 2007
Posts: 2577
Total Words: 157,150
Location: La.

Reputation: Highly regarded
Highly regarded  
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:21 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Aman wrote:
Ok Hammer(Alan),but good effort!
But my engine can run allmost continuously with milliseconds interval in between,and is controlled by Electronic control unit with Programing something analogous/Similar to modern engine valve timing.

Since your engine runs for some time,it is not a Perpectual motion machine!


Aman

Nor have I claimed it to be a perpetual motion machine. The machines I do now, do not need any outside energy except for gravity. Soon I will be showing some new videos of my work. No claims until I am ready to show. ;)



_________________
"Our education can be the limitation to our imagination, and our dreams"
________________

With out a dream, there is no vision.

Alan
Back to top
View user's profile Send email
Aman






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Any quiries?




Last edited by Aman on Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:12 pm; edited 1 time in total. (89 percent)
Back to top
View user's profile Blog
Aman






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

AB Hammer wrote:
Aman wrote:
Ok Hammer(Alan),but good effort!
But my engine can run allmost continuously with milliseconds interval in between,and is controlled by Electronic control unit with Programing something analogous/Similar to modern engine valve timing.

Since your engine runs for some time,it is not a Perpectual motion machine!


Aman

Nor have I claimed it to be a perpetual motion machine. The machines I do now, do not need any outside energy except for gravity. Soon I will be showing some new videos of my work. No claims until I am ready to show. ;)


?Oh,I was not telling that you have invented Perpectual machine!I know that you can achieve your dreams by constant effort!I am with you and will always support you!I am not discouraging you!I was just talking about my engine!Sorry if you felt bad!


Back to top
View user's profile Blog
Aman






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 5:09 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

raj wrote:
Make sure who will be the Patent Rights owner. You or your College, as they can process the patent application as APPLICANTS and you, only as inventor.
It's applicants who are patent rights owners. Not inventors.

Good Luck with your patent processing.

Raj

Thanks Raj,I was in hurry and iPad battery was low!By mistake I posted the comment!So I was not able to complete my comment!Please provide some details on patenting
Please email me at,
amansanat@gmail.com
In India,every thing happens slowly!The college lecturers promised me to help me out few days back!But I decided to also get some information myself!I already have started writing patent specification!I want my patent to be under international patent law!It will be definately helpful if you can email me some details!
Thanks
have a nice day!


Back to top
View user's profile Blog
Jim Williams
Aficionado
Aficionado

Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 640
Total Words: 55,600
Location: San Francisco

Reputation: Respected
Respected  
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:04 pm    Post subject: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual mot Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Aman


http://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?IC=f03b17%2F04&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&ST=advanced&compact=false&PN=in


Just for your information, there are two patents from India listed at the European Patent Office worldwide data base that claim some form of "perpetua mobilia".


Back to top
View user's profile Send email Skype Name
Aman






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Thanks Jim,
Some intelligent people can make Non-Perpectual gravity engines.
but are you sure that some are Perpectual ?
Let me check it out and see!
I am surprised that some are claimed to be Perpectual because you can't make energy out of nothing!
any way I will check out and see!

"An automatic prime mover.......without using fuel....."does not mean that fuel is not used!
The fuel used is fuel available in nature:
1)May be energy available from atmosphere or atoms,because photons always compress and store energy in atoms continuously .
2) May be fuel is the impulsive potential energy component of gravity.

May be the topic mentioned is not correctly mentioned.

The correct topic that should have been written should have been:

"An automatic prime mover for generating mechanical or electrical power without using any conventional fuel or other conventionally known power sources BUt with using freely available energy from nature."


Back to top
View user's profile Blog
Jim Williams






PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 6:52 pm    Post subject: re: Real gravity engine can be made:But Not a Perpectual mot Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

I did a search of Indian patents under International Patent Classification of F03B17/04, which is alleged perpetua mobilia, i.e. perpetual motion

I note with interest the patent documents themselves are not available, but the inventions are both also listed with a European Classification of Y02 E10/20 and an International Patent Classification of F03B17/02, neither of which is perpetual motion, gravity or otherwise.

Not having the inventions present, I'm not sure what the inventors claim. Sorry if I misled you.

edit - there are 1649 patents claiming perpetua mobilia at the European Patent Office, I found an additional five Indian patents, some including the document and with no other claim but to be perpetual motion.

http://worldwide.espacenet.com/searchResults?IC=f03b17%2F04&DB=EPODOC&locale=en_EP&IN=%5Bin%5D&ST=advanced&compact=false

Jim W.


Back to top
View user's profile Send email Skype Name
murilo
Addict
Addict

Joined: 07 Nov 2003
Posts: 3063
Total Words: 192,433
Location: sp - brazil

Reputation: Respected
Respected  
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Aman wrote:
Thanks Jim,
Some intelligent people can make Non-Perpectual gravity engines.
but are you sure that some are Perpectual ?
Let me check it out and see!
I am surprised that some are claimed to be Perpectual because you can't make energy out of nothing!
any way I will check out and see!

"An automatic prime mover.......without using fuel....."does not mean that fuel is not used!
The fuel used is fuel available in nature:
1)May be energy available from atmosphere or atoms,because photons always compress and store energy in atoms continuously .
2) May be fuel is the impulsive potential energy component of gravity.

May be the topic mentioned is not correctly mentioned.

The correct topic that should have been written should have been:

"An automatic prime mover for generating mechanical or electrical power without using any conventional fuel or other conventionally known power sources BUt with using freely available energy from nature."


Aman,
you are kindly welcome to BW forum, where your words are also free and opportune...
... but, please be advised, here at BW gravity IS absolutely considered something!
Best!
M
PS: BTW, I'm 100% 'outside of the wardrobe' and I do work on PMs items, as can be seen at 'ideas' in first page.


Back to top
View user's profile Send email Visit poster's website
Aman






PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 5:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Thanks Jim!
Thanks for understanding the reality!

It's ok!Its good if people discuss doubts so that I can tell reality to people.
According to new patent laws,a working prototype is needed as proof( which is thorough examined) for granting patents to Perpectual machine.
One possibility is this:
May be those machines were not Perpectual but principle of operation was difficult to understand by judges/ patent officers(possibility is less).
That's what I think patents might have granted and latter were in crirticism and got cancelled out.
Other possibility is this:
Those inventions were misunderstood by patent officers to be true and hence patents were granted and then might have gained criticism and got canceled.

The reason why Perpectual machines cannot exist is:
For example:In an IC Engine,piston moves up and down to convert reciprocating motion to rotary motion to make power.
This piston is pushed by combust gases/fuel.
If there is no combustion,the piston won't move down and up!For work to be done by engine,you need work to be done on that engine.
No,I am not conventional.Certain laws written in physics textbooks may be wrong and are wrong but there are few laws that cannot be changed.
Newton's laws and laws of thermodynamics can never be changed and common sense to me.For me newton's laws and laws of thermodynamics are very true and can never be challenged.There are few other laws not related to newton's or thermodynamics that are proved wrong in recent research but it's not surprising,because those laws were made with assumptions and Improper knowledge.




Last edited by Aman on Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:46 am; edited 5 times in total. (22 percent)
Back to top
View user's profile Blog
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic  Reply to topic    Forum Index -> General Discussion All times are GMT
Page 2 of 9 Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next


 
Jump to:   
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum

Log in:         Remember me     

Please click below to help support this website!

Google