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Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition

 
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Oxygon
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 1:34 am    Post subject: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Every now and then "Sears" comes out with new fancy "Why didn't I think of that!" ideas...

I have had for years now... "As I am sure you others out there"... Ideas of perpetual motion that utilize simple combinations of gadgets out there already but have yet to divulge such dusty ideas...

Whether it be for concerns about patent "pros and cons" or the inseparable parralel of conspiracy theories...

I have simplified ideas not yet on any page at least metioned on the internet or under any general scrutiny "as yet", However recently I viewed a very simaler idea only the inverse of my own... it seems just as obvious as my own and both are unique in design but the methods are different. After just a few days published it dissapeared...

Maybe the designer... like me became concerned about the implications of the methods simplicity...

Maybe thoughts of potential idea theft occured...

It sure would be the "worst case scenario" to publish an idea only to have it immeadeatly stolen and spend the rest of your life in a battle for true ownership... perhaps being cast as a "greedy selfish person" and having ones lifes work amount to nothing...

Just looking for some feed back...

P.S. - I am not a patent person...

Patents, Lawyers and attorneys scare me...

...I have velcro shoes. :P



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ken_behrendt
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:04 am    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

All inventors have a similar problem. On the one hand, they want the ego trip of announcing to the whole world some new device so they can then receive the praise of a grateful world whose lives have been made easier because of their invention. Yet, on the other hand, they also want to get something more substantial than verbal praise...like cold, hard, spendable CASH! In order to receive the second item, they are convinced that they must operate in total secrecy so their invention will not be immediately stolen by others who are smarter, greedier, and obviously evil!

Trying to reconcile these two mutually exclusive goals is, of course, extremely difficult to do. Most inventors are thus reduced to continuously dropping hints about something BIG that they are working on. Then, just as soon as someone expresses interest and asks a few questions, they can get even more secretive since it seems that their suspicions have all been confirmed!

People who make a buck off of "assisting" inventors are well aware of this dilemma and manage to handle it nicely. They will reassure the inventor that only they can be trusted with disclosure of the idea and that the non-disclosure agreement the inventor must sign proves this. They are fully aware that only a few percent of all inventions that are patented actually ever make a dime and, sadly, most patent applications are abandoned long before a patent is granted because of the burden of the extra fees associated with trying to modify a rejected application in order to turn it into a granted patent.

While only, perhaps, less than one percent of all patent applicants ever make any money off of their inventions, the "industry" that exists to provide them with "services" makes a buck 100% of the time!

Something to keep in mind if one decides to chase that temporary government granted monopoly on a device that no one may really want...


ken



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ovyyus
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:34 am    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

oxygon wrote:
It sure would be the "worst case scenario" to publish an idea only to have it immeadeatly stolen and spend the rest of your life in a battle for true ownership... perhaps being cast as a "greedy selfish person" and having ones lifes work amount to nothing...


I agree that fighting ownership issues for the rest of your life would be tragic. However, without disclosure your life's work WILL amount to nothing - guaranteed.


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jim_mich
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2006 12:50 pm    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

Oxygon,

We all have child like fears and questions concerning things we don't know, until we have learned.
Take a look at the U.S. Patent Office's WhoWhatWhenHowWhy Kids page.




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ken_behrendt






PostPosted: Mon Apr 10, 2006 7:52 am    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

According to the Patent Office:

Quote:
Throughout history, inventions have helped people discover new worlds, build communities, develop resources, increase productivity, cure diseases, ease burdens, and enjoy life to the fullest. Our Nation's founders recognized the importance of patents to protect the rights of inventors and included provisions for them in the Constitution. New inventions lead to new technologies, create new jobs, and improve our quality of life. Today, America's inventive spirit is one of our most treasured and envied assets, and the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office works to record, share, and preserve it. A patent helps an inventor to make money from his or her invention by allowing only the patentee or those who get his or her permission to make, use, import, sell or offer to sell the invention. Thus it encourages investing in research - which helps the nation.


I think that last line is important. Without a temporary monopoly on an invention, then what incentive would investors have to risk their money trying to develop or improve it? Someone else could come along, take their finished invention, and then sell it without having invested any money in its development.

Fortunately, aside from the effort I make in producing WM2D models in an effort to re-discover Bessler's lost mechanism, I am not really making much of a financial investment unless one counts my time at the keyboard. But, I probably would have "invested" the same amount of time whether I was actively chasing JB's secret or not.

However, if someone has spent years building models and finally does manage to get something that works, I could not blame them for wanting a patent so that they could recover their invested time, money, and effort.

I think that patents do serve a useful function. It's is just too bad that we still live in a world where we must fear having our ideas stolen by others. If not, then there would be no need for patents...


ken


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terry5732
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 4:12 am    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

I don't really like the idea of patenting ideas.
A patent should be granted to someone who BUILDS a better mousetrap - not the guy who merely says he has a way to make one.
Hows about someone patents an idea so as that it can't be made?
If the manufacturer is other than the inventer, he should compensate the inventer but that is for them to work out. The 'patent' should be exclusive manufacturing rights and only in force as long as someone is producing or attempting to.


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ken_behrendt






PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:04 pm    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Reply with quote Report Post to Admin

terry wrote:

Quote:
Hows about someone patents an idea so as that it can't be made?


There are, indeed, people doing something like this. They are now being referred to as "Patent Trolls". What they do is patent some very general idea and then, when some big corporation tries to patent a device that may use something vaguely similar to what the troll patented, he screams "Infringement!" and tries to shake the corporation down for millions of dollars. Unfortunately, many corporations submit to this form of blackmail so that they will not lose all of the money they invested in some invention. Who pays for it in the long run? You and me and the rest of the public, of course, when we have to pay more to buy or use the invention.

Personally, I do not think some vague idea should be patentable, but, rather, only an actual device of some sort that the inventor(s) built.


ken


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jim_mich






PostPosted: Tue Apr 11, 2006 12:21 pm    Post subject: re: Sears Gadgets / Disappearing Competition Report Post to Admin

Terry,

What you suggest is very similar to how the patent system works.

You don't get a patent just by having an idea. You get it by building a device, either physically or detailed enough on paper that it's plain to everyone as to how it can be built. If it's doubtful whether your device can be built and/or if it will work, then you will have a very difficult time getting a patent.

All a patent does is give an inventor the right to prevent others from making and/or using an invention. It is up to the parties involved to negotiate any conditions and/or payments.

Patents must be renewed every few years. If the renewal fee isn't paid the patent lapses and anyone can then make and/or use the patent. These fees get bigger each time. If you're not making the invention then you probably won't renew it and then other can make it.

Ken, yes there are a few patent 'trolls' but it is very difficult to anticipate some future invention. It is like getting an patent for a "self turning wheel". Without details of HOW the wheel works the patent has little worth. If/when someone eventually invents a self turning wheel it is highly unlikely the troll's patent would be the same.



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