Gyroscope theory

[KAS]

It has probably been done before but has anyone considered using gyroscopes.

Let's test the theory

If you consider say 4 gyroscopes anchored at one end to a central pivot forming a solid cross. I am using 4 in this example but it could be any equal number.

I am not sure about the mathematics behind the model but I know that a spinning gyroscope tends to transfer it's mass to it's anchor point whereas stationary one is dead weight.
Now, if we could transfer the kinetic energy stored in the spinning gyroscope at the top of the cycle coupled with the kinetic energy of the fall of a stationary Gyroscope to- lets say a fly wheel.

Then, here's the tricky bit - Transferring this energy to the gyroscope at the bottom of the cycle causing it to spin. the mass shifts to its central point (the pivot) at the 9,o'clock position . In theory this would render the Gyroscope positioned between the 9,o'clock and 12,o'clock weightless and would result in an off set of the mass of the whole device.

Thoughts please!

[ken_behrendt]

KAS...

In a sense, all that a gyroscope does is convert the torque around it's pivot due to gravity acting on the device into another torque at right angles to this torque. Thus, the gyroscope, while spinning, will not rotate downward around its point of contact with a support toward the Earth's center, but, rather, will rotate at right angles to that direction (the direction, of course, determined by the spin direction of the gyroscope's flywheel).

But, the mass of the gyroscope is not transfered anywhere. The weight of the gyroscope resting on the supporting pivot remains constant at all times. It's just that the spin of the flywheel prevent's this weight from causing the device to fall over and it sort of "falls" sideways.

Many attempts that been tried to build perpetual motion machines, reactionless propulsion systems, and levitation platforms from this interesting invention of the 19th century (although the basic principle was demonstrated for, perhaps, thousands of years in kid's tops). None of these attempts has ever been successful and none probably ever will be...


ken

[Vic Hays]

As Ken mentioned, a gyroscope transfers torque at right angles. If you place a gyroscope so its axle is at right angles to gravity and support only one end of the axle, it will torque in a circle around the supported end in response to gravity. If the gyro in unrestrained to rotate it will.

One might think that this torque could be used for power, but in reality the rotation is actually only in response to a continuous drop in the cg of the gyro. It works sort of like a ball going around a spiral track driven by gravity.

To understand this effect, make the axle rigid at 90 degrees so the gyro cannot drop and there will be no movement.

[rlortie]

Vic and Kas

I believe that you are both missing the main point.

That is "what is to power the Gyroscope" even if the idea was feasable?

Ralph

[LustInBlack]

Yes, don't you need something like 15000 rpm to get a "decent" effect !?

[Fletcher]

If it were possible, in the context of Bessler's wheels, you would probably use compressed air to drive them.

See this for precession etc

See this Howstuffworks web page for gyroscopes

[Vic Hays]

OK, I get it.

The idea is to stop one gyro and start another with the energy. This sounds a little like the ball bearings that impact one another and bounce back and forth.

A regenerative braking system would probably be too inefficient. A gear train with clutches would be fairly complex.

Perhaps it would work if the speed of one gyro was reduced instead of stopped and the other was increased with the energy. It seems that some kind of differential gear train could accomplish this. This is a similar type of gear system as the differential on a car. The rear wheels on a rear wheel drive car are free to turn at different speeds, even reverse, and yet they are connected to the drive source. Perhaps a small battery powered electric motor could be used for a proof of concept model or one could use the rotation of the wheel to power the gyros directly.

A planetery gear type system can do this.

[Vic Hays]

A planet or differential system with a windup spring such as a balance wheel in a clock could be used to stop and start the gyros.

In fact a spring system with the gyros being used like balance wheels coupled with a brake that is applied when the gyro slows to a stop could be used without even coupling the gyros together.

All that would be necessary would be to time the balance wheel/gyros to the rotational speed of the wheel.

The wheels would use the energy from the spring then slow and stop as the torque at the spring increased. a brake could be applied or if the timing was right the gyro could begin its reverse rotation without a brake using the energy from the spring. It would only take a very small supplemental energy boost to keep the gyros going.

Uh-oh. Another reactionless drive idea is surfacing. The torque from restarting the gyros could drive an outer wheel without torque being applied externally.

[Jon J Hutton]

Sounds like you all are on the same track as Randy Kidd and Thorensons G.I.T. experiments. I've often thought of applying the same principle to a wheel but always ran into a dead end of having to add more energy back to the gyro than was taken away from the precession or startup of another wheel. When you have to do that you are then in the area of competing with efficiency to thrust ratio and jet fuel and liquid hydrogen machines will always turn the heads of investors faster and keep us on this energy nosedive. It has to be free energy which means it has to be a PM machine.

JJH