Torque avalanche...

[iacob alex]

....process,can be a parallel,paraphrase that takes a pattern from the well known snow/mass gravity avalanche.

When a long arm-short arm configuration(with two equal masses at their ends) is free to make a full(up-down) fall,we have in fact a (difference) torque plunge ,thrust similar to an avalanche.

If the up-down fall is longer(time..height...slope) , we a stronger and stronger phenomenon.

With the same "input"(arm difference at the "up" position),you can get out a greater and greater "output" at the "down" position,if we play time/height factor!?

Avalanches are a natural phenomenon on a slope/inclined plane,in which mass can respond to the push of gravity.

A torque avalanche process can be considered alike?

Avalanches are born from a weakness in the snow...

Torque avalanches can be born from a "weakness of equilibrium",that small difference of torque that is free to develop,extend in time/height.

The whole key to avalanches is gravity.

The whole key to a gravity powered device is an avalanche process,too?!


All the Bests! / Alex

[murilo]

" The whole key to a gravity powered device is an avalanche process,too?! ''

Yes, Alex... yes!
From an apparent pure potential avalanche starts to fall and move under gravity celeration - a summ.
Cheers!
M.

[iacob alex]

Hi M. !

If we intent to make three steps(observation,perception,,knowledge) only...into the real world phenomena(mass avalanche...),the next connexion can be into abstracts(torque avalanche).

A same/constant input(snow,mass,torque difference...) ,can develop an increasing output,when we have a longer slope/inclined plane.

If you take a look at www.geocities.com/iacob_alex/Stellarotor.htm then "Drafts",then "Mail0004"(Gravity wheel concept),you can understand better than words...

Now,supposing that we have longer and longer arms(R2,R3),is seems to me analogous to an ever extended slope/inclined plane.

All that we need are some mental images regarding VAP-variable arm procedure,so to determine a self process.


All the Bests! / Alex

[murilo]

Alex,
wow!!!
At distance, I can smell a fried brain! =s
Good and clear designs. Congratulations by your mental vision.
Any model?
To make a model is some thing extremely hard and painfull.
Sorry, but there I couldn't reach to the avalanche concept.
Best regs. M.

[iacob alex]

Hi M. !

The avalanche concept(what a name...!),was suggested,playing at one site with a lab-demo,one year ago.

If you type on Google "atwood heavy pulley",it's possible to find it.

It was a situation with a particular Atwood Machine:a heavy pulley.

More,I played an extreme pair of values:mass difference 0,2kg,pulley mass 1000kg.After waiting a little time,I was surprised:it worked very slow at the beggining,then some faster and faster...in the gravity fall style.

On an Atwood Machine,we have equal arms and a small mass difference on them...so un unequal cross product/torque and...potential gravity flow.Nothing more...

Then I made the connection with the long arm-short arm configuration with equal masses,in the same gravitational frame...and the very small difference of arms.
The plain discussion can be about torque/cross product of mass and distance to the fulcrum-pivot.

The next "flash" was something around us...an avalanche of snow.

Sure,this time was a rotational "avalanche",spinning on a pivot...and the problem,search to transfere in a separate design,the classical long arm-short arm.

All the Bests! / Alex

[murilo]

Alex,
hello!
No, I can't follow you.

I can see avalanche possible ocurrence in potentials applied over non-horizontal surfaces.

Since you like the word avalanche, pls, go to:

http://www.besslerwheel.com/murilo/index.html

I like this word too. :)
Best regs. Murilo

[iacob alex]

Hi Murilo!

For me ,the word "avalanche" is not an amassing process,as you can see in reality or a stretching method,as in your design ...but "something unseen",that's the quadratic property of this specific flow:gravity.

Avalanche is an appearance,visage between many others of the same gravitational phenomenon.

I try to use and collect this resource with a retarding "parachute way",coiling it ,in a spinning mass:gravity into inertia,or translation into inertia.
By the way:you can "fall" in so many ways...


All the Bests! / Alex

[iacob alex]

...it may be seen as an ever greater mechanical phenomenon,if you take a look at www.geocities.com/iacob_alex then click at "Some_Drafts/text045.jpg with the title "A small confusion!?"

The same torque difference ,develops an increasing nonlinear amazing thing...if we modify one dimension only,of a two spokes "wheel".

All the Bests! / Alex

[murilo]

Alex, hi!
This thread is getting very dynamic!
I didn't reach to your mind.
Your site is very impressive!
Cheers!
Murilo

[iacob alex]

...as a mechanical process developed due to gravity,can be considered,in two different cases:

-constant arm:Atwood machine with a heavy pulley.

-variable arm :
-a full up-down falling/rotational pendulum with a heavy hub

-a full up-down falling pendulum equivalent (two unequal arms lever,eventually with two equal masses at their ends).

So,if we have this interesting phenomenon,can we use it in a non destructive manner,let's say,to imagine a PM ?!

All the best! / Alex

[murilo]

Iacob, hi!
Can you send some draws?
The above links are no more ok.
( I forgot all the points in this thread.)
BTW, have you seen my new 3D draws at avalanchedrive?
Best! Murilo

[iacob alex]

Hi Murilo !

There is a lot of proposals of "vertical belt" on net:the most of them are imagined inside water...your "avalanchedrive" is "out of water".

The first design of this type ,was pictured in the 19-th century,so long time ago...with so many paraphrases,along the time.

To exploit the possibilities of a natural phenomenon (avalanche,cascade) can be a spontaneous,essential idea...a suitable first step.

The second step,to conceive the "know how" on paper, can be your personal "adventure".

The most important step,you guess...is to test it into reality.

Sorry about my "virtual exhibition"/web-site...it's closed,for a certain period,who knows how long?

For the moment,I like better to be one who looks on this "marathon",with some discrete comments,nothing more.

All the best! / Alex

[murilo]

Alex,
yes.
In the past there was dozens of other chains.
Please, be kind to tell me if you find ANY as mine!
The basic idea is that the zig-zag chain offers volumetric variations according its state... this chain, with this property, is obviously well known.
The innovation is the use and comand I propose to it in a closed circuit.
Best regards!
Muliro

[iacob alex]

Hi Murilo!

Likely,your "zig-zag chain" design,with "volumetric"/mass variation is unique and impressive..

In my opinion,you play an impressionist style,as painting or writing,to give general effect without detail...

...but you know,the "devil" can find here a place.

Take this as a word-joke,please.

Now,speaking seriously...as I see the things, you play this PM game,to get a torque difference on the same side of the fulcrum ,in the manner "equal arms and unequal masses".

I wish you success...

The other manner is "unequal arms/long arm>short arm and equal masses".

All the best! / Alex

[murilo]

Alex,
anyhow, thanks for your words.
If the devil was some stuff in the hell and outside the people, I would know to deal him much better.
Up to now, none s.o. a bitch was able to destroy my arguments with mechanics logic.
You see, I'm alone where corporations still are not!
( wow!!! This is really dramatic... well, maybe with some heavy latin sauce... :)
So are aliens, specially for those who have their feet cemented in their yards!
All the very best!
Murilo