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eccentrically1
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
His website says all quotes are from John's book
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daxwc
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:03 pm    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
nicbordeaux


Quote:
The statement means that and that alone (don't question my French lingo skills or I'll send you my cv lol), the rest is nit picking.

The day arises energy can be obtained from splitting hairs, some guys on this forum are going to power the world ;-)


The problem is that it is very hard to make 25 year old scotch by sucking on lemons. Bessler in my opinion has purposely let people deceive themselves, he is not even bellying up to the same trough.
Has it never occur to anybody the reason they can’t even find an energy gain might be because you’re missing key facts.

I will give you that, he does say the principle is simple and did comment on its mathematical simplicity.




Quote:
His website says all quotes are from John's book

That helps a lot.



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Wile E. Coyote - super genius; “I like the way that rolls out”
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daxwc
PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:47 pm    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
Quote:
Because, however, the whole account is false, and the contrary can be shown by many witnesses to whom Orffyreus and his profession are well-known, it appears that the defender does not dare to pass the truth too closely in this accompanying point, and one is not promised anything much better from the remaining text. It is already known that his real name is not Orffyreus but Bessler, and his trade is carpenter; after some time he applied himself to medicine and organ making and promised to achieve wonderful things in these fields. When reasonable people ask him various things in order to learn whether he knows his art, his answer is always the same: "Oh, that you would not ask me such trivial things." When these professions did not go well, he turned from Leipzig to Gera, and having heard a great many discussions and accounts of people trying to invent a perpetual motion machine, he finally tried his luck and elaborated in vain on his project for many years. Wagner’s critiques 1





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He passed me off - I swear it - as a
carpenter. As you recall, I was already so well versed in many a
craft that I was able quickly to imitate any piece of workmanship I
saw carried out. It was a gift from God to be able to learn quickly
the most difficult things. Gartner, of course, will hardly be able to
believe that it is I who am writing these words! AP 266


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eccentrically1
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:05 am    Post subject: Re: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
daxwc wrote:

Has it never occur to anybody the reason they can’t even find an energy gain might be because you’re missing key facts.


I think that has occurred to everyone.

Quote:
I will give you that, he does say the principle is simple and did comment on its mathematical simplicity.


So why wouldn't it follow that the mechanism would be simple?

Quote:
His website says all quotes are from John's book

Quote:
That helps a lot.


Hey, I'm just sayin'.


We need to start a mechanism thread.
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daxwc
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 12:28 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
eccentrically1
Quote:
So why wouldn't it follow that the mechanism would be simple?
It might not be and considering how long it took him to build them. For example the principle behind a car is fairly simple. You burn gas as a source of energy, then harness the energy to propel the car forward. Now is the mechanism simple?
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eccentrically1
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 1:44 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
Quote:
It might not be and considering how long it took him to build them. For example the principle behind a car is fairly simple. You burn gas as a source of energy, then harness the energy to propel the car forward. Now is the mechanism simple?


It was on the first cars. Now they're nightmares of components.
But the mechanism in a car, even the first cars, isn't simply propelling a single, stationary, weight driven wheel, either. That's a weak analogy.
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ovyyus
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:04 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
Complicated applications of simple principles is what we do best :D
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rlortie
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 2:34 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
Complicated applications of simple principles is the same as what you find on products purchased now days!

Only it is abbreviated to read. 'CONSUMER EXPENDABLE' DO NOT OPEN, NO REUSABLE PARTS INSIDE.

Ralph
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path_finder
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 9:54 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
daxwc wrote:
For example the principle behind a car is fairly simple. You burn gas as a source of energy, then harness the energy to propel the car forward. Now is the mechanism simple?

Some mechanisms are simple. See my signature.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2iXwthI2YQ



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I cannot imagine why nobody though on this before, including myself? It is so simple!...
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iacob alex
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:36 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
.....as an opportunity,favorable condition to think about some outward appearances (combustion vs. gravity engine),in a two steps sequence:

-cause (to set on fire,ignite gas vs....to provoke,raise a small disturbance in the gravity field).

-effect (expansive power of matter/gas vs.... accelerated motion due to gravity fall ).

The problem is to perform a great " fire" (gravity fall) with a tiny "spark" (gravity unbalance).

Remember that a seesaw is a lever (a bar,a fulcrum,effort/load pair),or the starting point of mechanics...

All the best! / Alex



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iacob alex
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:21 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
.....and think about a possible self rotating device,due to gravity fall and inertia (in-out) rotational storage.

Why?

If an idea can be the root of creation,in my opinion,this time we can play a little "modified" seesaw (a lever with a single variable arm).

A children game can be the most valuable resource to realize that old "dream" of our ancestors...

Our only problem:who will be the man of action?

Our chance:a man of action to reflect,meditate,imagine "deeper" about the lever concept.

All the best! / Alex
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nicbordeaux
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
Not sure I get you Alex. You keep posting about the seesaw with a simple telescopic (one assumes) arm. Are you unable to build one ? No disrespect meant, a plain question. Happens I agree with you, a seesaw with an adjustable arm is a simpler implementation of OB than a wheel with weights trundling all over the place and smashing things up.
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daanopperman
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 5:48 pm    Post subject: Re: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
iacob alex wrote:
Hi Daan!

Your proposal ,in my opinion ,is on the line:"why make simple,when you can make complex?" (P_F signature ...on this forum).

The problem is that the simplicity is the first step (..."glory of expression".../Walt Whitman),if you intend to play all kind of diversities.

It's a question of style :the particularity tends to ornate,decorate,adorn the basic(s)...but you need the base,firstly.

So,you can play science (Archimedes),or a mystic story (Jacob's ladder) ...here is your choice.

All the best! / Alex

Alex ,
I called it Jacob's ladder for if you take two round pieces of wood and fit a Jacob's ladder on it , it will serve the same function as the 2 gears on the weights , when I could not complete the mechanism because I did not have matching gears it took quite a while before I saw the Jacob's ladder and how to use it .
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iacob alex
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:45 pm    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
Hi !

The (single) variable arm of a lever,as a minimal expression of a possible self-working device due to gravity and inertia can embrace a lot of shapes:
-telescopic,if you prefer
-Jacob's ladder,if you like it
-simple hinged end of the arm,if you respect the very old designs
-many others...

Your imagination can play around this simple concept,as easy as in a real seesaw play...

If you replace (in some way...) the usual swinging motion,with an "unusual" continuous rotation (due to gravity fall and inertia ),you have a captivating plaything ...

A new toy can open new vistas for the future...

By the way (regarding test models for the topic of this forum...see my web-site):sometimes I am living by acts,sometimes I am living by ideas.

The necessity is blind until it becomes conscious...so, maybe it's a simple question of time.

All the best! / Alex
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iacob alex
PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 9:23 am    Post subject: re: Play seesaw... Reply with quote Report Post to Admin
....as a "complete" game (not only small swinging motions around the horizontal line...but a "full 360* go round).

Then try to think about and imagine a "self-rotation" (due to gravity and inertia).

Sure,the practical effect of an opinion is the real test...but this time we start with an amusement game ...

All the best! / Alex
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