one weight arranges the other

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Georg Künstler
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one weight arranges the other

Post by Georg Künstler »

agor95 wrote:
If we are forced to gravitate to a solution with that restriction
then it would be caused by the interaction of two different inertial masses.

These would interact in a rotating inertial frame.

However it is good to know I am not going into free space just yet.
Rotate this in a Frame as it was suggested. you will get the springs relaxed / tense during the rotation
Attachments
rolling cylinders
rolling cylinders
and compressed
and compressed
one frame
one frame
3 Chambers, 3 rollers
3 Chambers, 3 rollers
and nearly completed
and nearly completed
Best regards

Georg
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Post by jonnynet »

Hello Georg,

as a german by myself it's nice to have a new post from you since a really very very long time. Your builds were always remarkable, as I remember. I also have to try another approach to support my own principle. It's all about leverage applied at the right place!
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by agor95 »

Hi Georg

Thanks for showing your design. I think the original quote was related to non-gravity solution. However you have been inspired so great.

If you want to supply dimensions, masses, spring strength and spring length then I could look at some dynamic modeling.
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by Georg Künstler »

Measurement of the parts
D of the wheel is 126 cm
rollers compressed 30 cm
frames opening 22,5 degrees deep 41 cm
3 frames with the same size
rollers expanded 41 cm
spring stength i don,t know, but the cylinder weight can compress it
weight of two rollers with spring is 7 kg.

hope this measurements are enough for your simulation.
Attachments
Expanded Rollers
Expanded Rollers
frame
frame
weight
weight
compressed
compressed
wheel in start position, in which direction ?
wheel in start position, in which direction ?
Best regards

Georg
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by jonnynet »

I made a quick simulation with different measurements. Driven by a motor to see how the weight pairs inside the chambers will behave during a full revolution.
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3chawhl_gk.gif
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by sleepy »

Well,based on the sim,it's a non-runner.
Trying to turn the spinning in my brain into something useful before moving on to the next life.
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by Georg Künstler »

Thanks a lot for the simulation.
The movement is different to that what you have in your simulation. The opening frame has 22,5 Grad. The length of the rollers is compressed 30 cm, so the rollers can not flip over, so gravity is still pressing the spring together.
Have a look to the first 3 chamber wheel where the rollers are in the down position.
Have also a look to Besslers 3 chamber wheel where he is saying "and you still don't understand".
Best regards

Georg
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by agor95 »

Hi Georg

Thank you for the details. Based on the post the masses roll.
Would you consider a controlled rotation rate.

I am really not looking at your device from a non-runner perspective.

More like what can help move it forward or around.

I am thinking the CF and gravity can compress
the spring. Then as it rotates the spring drops expands.
This hopefully allows the spring assemble to bounce up.
That can be captured so it is closer to the axle on the way
up than on the way down.

However it will be one directional.
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by Georg Künstler »

Hi Agor95,
I expect a slow rotation in one direction, I can test my wheel on Saturday when the wheel will be placed on the frame support.

It will not be a wheel with power, but I expect self rotating. I will see.

It is a controlled move, using its own swinging of the masses.
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Georg
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by agor95 »

A Mobile that perpetuates is a good start.

Good Luck
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by Georg Künstler »

We tested the wheel construction on Saturday.

As we can see in the current run the springs strength is not correct.

Also we could see that the frames where the cylinders are rolling must be adjusted.

So in the moment it is a non runner.
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Georg
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by ChrisHarper »

Hi,

I do like your design for many reasons, for it is the dictionary definition of 'two weights working together', but that could also mean equal and opposite .

I applaud -

1. It's mechanical simplicity ( Occam's Razor )

2. Relatively minimal movement

3. The 120 degree chamber spacing.

4. The use of guided spring to displaced not drive.

Can you not use one central mass supported by a lightweight cart in each chamber as this will summate the CoM of two weighted roller/wheels.



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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by Georg Künstler »

Maybe I can change my 3 chamber wheel to this design.

Weights are connected with springs.

I will see.
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one weight is arranging the other
one weight is arranging the other
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Georg
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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by ChrisHarper »

Georg,

Careful that presumptive thoughts don't lead you down a dead-end.

You assume that circular motion is the cause rather than just a summated consequence of an established mechanical advantage.

Each chamber, as a single entity, must defy the current Lever-Laws and the 3 established classes. Theoretically , there should be no reason or need to repeat a mechanism around the clock-face to induce sustained rotation

Rotation will be just an example of industrial application of the non-rotary mechanism. ?

Treat each mechanism as an isolated system. Then determine / measure the height for width benefit.

Personally, I have always liked the 3spoke engraving .

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re: one weight arranges the other

Post by nebollinger »

What I see is a bottom heavy mass if you draw a circle around the weights
and compare that with the axle......there is more weight below the axle than above so it keels.... and stops.

Am I right?

Norman
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