Re: I'd like your opinions, regular posters


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Posted by Darren (65.33.33.127) on April 29, 2003 at 21:17:26:

In Reply to: Re: I'd like your opinions, regular posters posted by Nick Hall on April 29, 2003 at 14:54:20:

>>It is amazing how you can feel certain that you have the answer, but instead it becomes a means to refine your understanding of basic mechanics and physics!

Believe me Nick, I had a stomache ache for an hour before I sent that email to Sterling. I've certainly stung myself in the past with wanting to jump the gun... but I *have* refined my knowledge of mechanics and physics to the point where I am 100% certain that this design is it. I know, I know, famous last words of every FE afficianado in the past 900 years... but hey, when you can find the flaws in every single design you find on the internet but you can't find anything wrong anywhere in your own it's possibly time to at least give it a try, right? Heck, what's it going to hurt really except maybe my wallet and my ego :-)

: I would also add several notes of caution when trying to fathom things out from the "clues" we have from Bessler:

Cool... shoot (I love debating Bessler history, but John's way better at it than me :-) Okay... shifting into debate mode...

: -- There is real ambiguity in the accuracy of many of the English translations - his German was "quirky" to say the least.

Any ambiguity in the translations most likely comes from the translators trying to figure out *any* 17th/18th century German writer, not just Bessler. I don't know that's really Bessler's fault. Question; do you read German? Have you read Bessler's original writings as he penned them? How do you know his German was quirky?

: -- He did deliberately try to mislead people.

What do you base that statement on? From what I've read he supported every single claim he made, attended every demonstration he advertised (except for that Easter Leipzig Fair where he got sick), passed every test parameter provided by scientific individuals and the investigative groups, and never took money from anyone except for Karl who saw the workings of the wheel and was convinced it was genuine. Other than the fact that there isn't a working Bessler wheel today, what did he promise that he never delivered? Where did he try to mislead people?

: -- His 'clues' have more the status IMHO of "coded prior art". They were such that if someone else went public with a working wheel before he had found a buyer, then at least he could point to his published 'clues' and with some suitable 'key' demonstrate that he had also discovered the motive principle beforehand. In other words, it was a kind of insurance that if he was not to be remembered as the first person to demonstrate "perpetual motion", at least he would have the means to show he was not a fraud.

Not sure that's a bad thing. It actually sounds quite reasonable to me. One little sidenote though... take one look at my design and then read through Apologia Poetica and you'll quickly get a big grin on your face. His clues were not just vague coded clues that could fit various devices... like a horoscope conveniently fits many people... the clues fit his (and my) design very closely... creeped me out when I went back and read it. It's weird when you suddenly understand someone's apparently insane rantings :-) Yes, they were coded, but no they weren't insane, they are just visual pictures from nature that are similar to the different mechanical configurations within the wheel. There is an anvil in the wheel, there are planets of different sizes, there are ghosts poking through heyholes, and the dog does indeed creep out of his kennel just as far as his chain will stretch... :-)

When it's done the credit will ultimately need to go to Bessler, because he's the one who built it first... I just figured out how to duplicate it.

Which reminds me... if someone invents something totally novel and totally useful in 1727, but then it's lost for alomst 300 years... can you then build one and patent it in the year 2003 or will someone cry "prior art?" Probably a silly question... just curious.

: Good luck!
: Nick

Thanks Nick!!
Darren


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