Re: My position

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Posted by ovyyus (203.26.14.3) on April 26, 2003 at 17:05:55:

In Reply to: Re: My position posted by David on April 26, 2003 at 11:45:03:

: There is also no evidence to prove the contrary and that's my whole point of it. For every actual piece of REAL historical data that's had a circumstancial idea put towards it that favors it being real, the same can be done in reverse. I can also show how for every "it's impossible for a 500 pound machine to run for 54 days on stored power" statements to be quite untue and I am about to.

ovyyus: I would submit that a 'real' piece of historical data, as you put it, is without contemporary 'circumstantial ideas' for or against it. It is what it is and YOU can spin it either way (pun intended).

: : If you really want everyone to sit up and take notice then why not replicate Bessler's 'faked' demonstrations.

: Take notice of what my dear friend?

ovyyus: Your joking, right?

: : Nothing like a good old fashioned demonstration to win an arguement :)

: Amen, why don't you go ahead then and build a real model??? Prove it to the world. (which by the way is opposite to your already admited position that it wasn't real perpetual motion. Oy Vey.)

ovyyus: I see how you could be easily confused. What I meant was that Bessler may not have understood an environmental energy gain in his system. Leibniz said it best when he commented that he thought some 'physical principle' was at work inside the wheel. He and Wolff thought the obviously remarkable actions of the wheel could not have been PM because they thought that was impossible. Yet they were convinced Bessler was not a fraud (unlike yourself), just that his definition of PM may have been based on limited knowledge. Interestingly, Leibniz (and Wolff) seemed very impressed with the wheel because he felt that even if it was driven by some internal physical principle, and not PM, the end result was the same. IMO, a fair and open-minded scientific position to take.

Regards, ovyyus

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Comments:	: <snip : : There is also no evidence to prove the contrary and that's my whole point of it. For every actual piece of REAL historical data that's had a circumstancial idea put towards it that favors it being real, the same can be done in reverse. I can also show how for every "it's impossible for a 500 pound machine to run for 54 days on stored power" statements to be quite untue and I am about to. : ovyyus: I would submit that a 'real' piece of historical data, as you put it, is without contemporary 'circumstantial ideas' for or against it. It is what it is and YOU can spin it either way (pun intended). : : : If you really want everyone to sit up and take notice then why not replicate Bessler's 'faked' demonstrations. : : Take notice of what my dear friend? : ovyyus: Your joking, right? : : : Nothing like a good old fashioned demonstration to win an arguement :) : : Amen, why don't you go ahead then and build a real model??? Prove it to the world. (which by the way is opposite to your already admited position that it wasn't real perpetual motion. Oy Vey.) : ovyyus: I see how you could be easily confused. What I meant was that Bessler may not have understood an environmental energy gain in his system. Leibniz said it best when he commented that he thought some 'physical principle' was at work inside the wheel. He and Wolff thought the obviously remarkable actions of the wheel could not have been PM because they thought that was impossible. Yet they were convinced Bessler was not a fraud (unlike yourself), just that his definition of PM may have been based on limited knowledge. Interestingly, Leibniz (and Wolff) seemed very impressed with the wheel because he felt that even if it was driven by some internal physical principle, and not PM, the end result was the same. IMO, a fair and open-minded scientific position to take. : Regards, ovyyus
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